@All:
So hab dann nochmal überarbeitet. Schaut Euch unser "Werk" mal kritisch an. Ich habe die Fragen, die als einfach bezeichnet wurden, unten angefügt.
Ehrlich gesagt halte ich die Ravener-Frage auch für klar, denn eigentlich muss es 3 Möglichkeiten geben, davon haben wir 2 in der Begründung genannt und die dritte scheint hier zuzutreffen:
A: nur ein einziges Modell der rotte darf die Ausrüstung haben
B: alle Modelle in der Rotte müssen die Ausrüstung haben
C: beliebig viele modelle in der Rotte dürfen die ausrüstung haben
Ich bin wie gesagt kein Regelprofi, aber von der Logik her, wenn man unsere Argumentation liest, ist irgendwie klar warum er die Formulierung gewählt hat, wenn sie auch als solche verbesserungsfähig erscheint.
Außerdem habe ich noch ein Blabla-Intro eingefügt, wer zwischen den Zeilen liest erkennt dass der Codex nicht in jedem Punkt gut ankam.
Viele Grüße
Glassmoon
PS: als Unterzeichner sollten wir GW-Fanworld als erste setzen, und dann alphabetisch, oder?
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Dear Games-Workshop-Team,
Dear Robin,
As huge German fans of Games-Workshop in general and – in particular – the Tyranids, we were very happy that the Codex Tyranids has been redone in 2009/2010, coming along with many new awesome Models such as the Trygon.
Hence, we were all very delighted when first reading Codex: Tyranids (2010). Especially the new Tyranid stories, Artworks, new Tyranid units and many of the adjusted rules from the old (2005) Codex Options were taken with wide acceptance around the German 40k-Community. However, while reading the new Codex, some questions/problems arose while trying to apply some of the new/adjusted rules in the book.
We think that you will find it easy to receive a summarized version of the issues we were able to identify in connection with Codex: Tyranids (2010). We added some possible arguments to discuss along with the questions. Finally, we included some possible answers. As we were not sure which answer should be applicable, we included both “negative” and “positive” results.
We would be very pleased if you could soon publish the first Codex: Tyranids (2010) FAQ in order to clarify the issues below. Please feel free to use this summary as a discussion basis – we would be very proud if we could find some – if not all – of these questions/arguments/answers in the (hopefully soon) upcoming Tyranids FAQ.
With kind regards
XXXXXXX
‘1) Do the effects of Tyranid close combat weapons (TCCW) stack, for example, if a Tyranid Warrior is equipped with Scything Talons and Rending Claws, does he have to chose whether his CC-attacks are rending, or he may re-roll dice results of 1? Or could possibly both rules be granted at the same time to the same model?
Possible arguments: Since TCCW grant their bearers special rules, they should count as special close combat weapons (SCCW) according to the rulebook, page 42. The effects of SCCW generally do not stack, e.g. the effects of power fists and power claws cannot be used at the same time. However, the description texts of the TCCW on page 84 in the Codex: Tyranids (2010) indicate that simply bearing the weapon grants their effect to the equipped model. If TCCW would be declared as "Weapons Biomorph" instead of the rulebook term "Close Combat Weapons" (CCW), just like in the old Tyranid codex, there would not be any issue to discuss. But CCWs should follow their rules depicted in the rulebook on page 42.
Possible answer I: Tyranid close combat weapons count as weapons Biomorphs. Hence, the effects of several TCCW can be used at the same time if the unit is equipped accordingly. Tyranid organisms are created to fulfil their dedicated purpose, and anything else would mean a weakness that the Hive Mind could easily compensate.
Possible answer II: Tyranid close combat weapons count as special weapons. Hence, the effects of several TCCW cannot be used at the same time if the unit is equipped accordingly. Tyranid organisms are highly specialised o fulfil their dedicated purpose and therefore always choose the deadliest and most appropriate weapon to crush their enemies.
2) Do Tyranid close combat weapons (TCCW) accumulate with “Toxin Sacks” (poisoned weapons)? Or does the bearer have to decide whether to use the Toxin Sacks or his other close combat weapons?
Possible arguments: The Biomorph "Toxin Sacks" turns all TCCW that a creature is equipped with into poisoned weapons. Toxin Sacks are SCCW according to rulebook on page 42. The rules for Toxin Sacks indicate that the poisoned weapons become "Poison Weapons" (hence losing all their other special rules). However, it might be intended that the "Poison" special rules are granted additionally to the TCCW's normal effects (e.g. "Rending" for Rending Claws etc. - combining rending claws with
Toxin Sacks would result in poisoned and rending attacks).
Possible answer I: Toxin Sacks grant their effect in addition to any other equipped Tyranid close combat weapon. The poisonous effect of the Toxin sacks grants their bearer’s even deadlier methods to bring death upon the enemies of the Hive Mind.
Possible answer II: Toxin Sacks do not grant their effect in addition to any other equipped Tyranid close combat weapon. The Toxin sack poison is directly affecting the bloodstream of its poor victims and therefore not affected by the weapon that is used to inject it.
3) Can the Mawlock Deep Strike directly into an enemy unit?
Possible arguments: When using the Deep Strike rule, you must physically place one model of the deep striking unit on the table. (In 4th edition, you could simply declare any target point, but in 5th edition, you have to place the deep striking model itself onto the game board). According to the rulebook, you cannot place models on top of an enemy unit, since you must always maintain at least 1 inch distance from all enemy models. Hence, is it possible to declare the Mawlock's target point on top/within an enemy unit? If you would not be able to deep strike on top of an enemy unit, you would have to rely on that the Mawlock scatters exactly in the direction of a unit in order to be able to use the Mawlock’s special deep strike attack. The rule would only make sense if a "hit" result can actually hit the targeted unit. This is only possible if we may place him directly upon the (unlucky) enemy unit.
Possible answer I: When using the Mawlock’s deep strike rule, the Mawlock may be placed directly upon any enemy unit before the scatter distance and direction is determined. The powerful Hive Mind is able to force the Mawlock’s to deep strike directly into the heart of the enemy forces without even hesitating.
Possible answer II: While placing the Mawlock on the table to deep strike, he has to follow the rules as described in the rulebook. Hence, 1 inch distance has to be maintained from any enemy unit before rolling any scatter dice. Even the powerful Hive Mind is not able to force its units to perform suicide missions, but even the most fortunate opponent can never feel safe from the wrath of a deep striking Mawlock.
4) Are cover saves allowed against wounds inflicted by the Mawlock’s "Terror from the Deep" attack?
Possible arguments: No applicable rule can be found whether cover saves are generally not allowed against wounds inflicted by special rules. However, when interpreting the rules defined for being hit by barrage weapons, the direction from which the target is hit is measured from the middle of the template.
Possible answer I: Cover saves cannot be taken against the "Terror from the Deep attack, since all terrain that might have granted any cover is busted through the air when a Mawlock emerges from below the surface.
Possible answer II: Cover saves can be taken following the standard rules for barrage weapons if a unit is hit by the “Terror from the Deep”-Attack. Hence, if the centre of the 5” template lies behind any cover (such as a wall) as seen from the unit's location or if the unit (and not the centre of the template) is positioned in area terrain, cover saves may be taken. Otherwise, no cover saves may be granted against the "Terror from The Deep".
5) Does the Doom of Malan'Tai's special ability "Spirit Leech" affect units which are embarked within a transport?
Possible arguments: Referring to the Codex: Tyranids (2010), "Spirit Leech" is neither a psychic power, nor a shooting attack. It simply affects all enemy non-vehicle units within 6 inches. Embarked units are non-vehicles and they count as being on the table, e.g. embarked units can claim mission objectives. However, embarked units cannot be affected by shooting attacks since they are not a valid target in means of the basic shooting rules. Due to the fact that "Sprit leech" is not a shooting attack, but a special rule, it is not necessary to select any target.
As a result, there should be good reasons to argue that embarked units are vulnerable to the Spirit Leech as they count as being on the table.
Possible answer I: Yes. The Doom of Malan'Tai's special ability "Spirit Leech" can affect embarked units, if the transport is within range. How could a metal tank hull protect you from the mighty powers of the Hive Mind that could - with a blink of an eye - leech your puny soul?
Possible answer II: No. The Doom of Malan'Tai's special ability "Spirit Leech" cannot affect embarked units. Before using the Spirit Leech, the Doom of Malan’Tai’s must establish a connection to the soul of its victims. Even the Doom of Malan’Tai’s must ensure whose soul is appropriate to absorb.
6) Are any cover saves allowed against the Doom of Malan'Tai's special ability "Spirit Leech"?
Possible arguments: It is not clearly defined whether cover saves can only be taken against shooting attacks. "Spirit Leech" is not a shooting attack, so it is unclear whether the Doom's enemies can take cover saves against the Spirit Leech, e.g. when hiding in area terrain or behind a wall/fence etc. In contrary, it is not possible to take cover saves in close combat due to the close combat rules. For special abilities like "Spirit Leech", no applicable rule could be found in the codex or the rulebook.
Possible answer I: Enemy units affected by the Doom of Malan'Tai's special ability "Spirit Leech" cannot take cover saves. As described above, how could a tiny fence or tree protect you from the mighty powers of the Hive Mind?
Possible answer II: Enemy units affected by the Doom of Malan'Tai's special ability "Spirit Leech" can take cover saves. As described above, before using the Spirit Leech, the Doom of Malan’Tai’s must establish a connection to the soul of its victims that can be interrupted by physical objects.
7) Can Tyranid models equipped with wings enter the game following deep strike rules?
Possible arguments: In the codex Tyranids 2010, it is said that models equipped with wings are treated in the same way as Jump Infantry (as described in the 5th Edition rulebook).
Does this allow them to make use of the mission special rule "deep strike"? On one hand, "move in the same way as Jump Infantry" could mean that models with wings use all rules that are stated for the movement of jump infantry on page 52 of the rulebook. These rules would include the option of deep striking.
On the other hand, "deep strike" is not a kind of movement, but a mission special rule that gives jump infantry another option how to enter the game. On page 52, it is defined that "all jump infantry may enter the battle by deep strike". As models with wings are not classified as jump infantry, but only move like jump infantry, they may not be able to use the "deep strike" mission special rule. The Chaos FAQ states that:
Q: "Does taking "wings" classify a model as jump infantry?"
A: "No, it simply allows the model to move like jump infantry."
Possible answer I: As "deep strike" is no kind of movement, but a mission special rule that gives jump infantry another option how to enter the game board, models with wings are not allowed to deep strike. Large winged Tyranid organisms have to stay within synapse range of lesser creatures to enforce the will of the Hive Mind.
Possible answer II: Wings of Tyranid organisms also grant their bearers the deep strike ability. No wall or fence can protect you from the will and the wrath of the Hive Mind.
8) Can you please clarify which Tyranid units may use the tunnel created by a Trygon?
Possible arguments: The rules in the new Codex: Tyranids (2010) state that "only infantry models" can enter the game by using a previously dig Trygon tunnel exhaust. Does “only infantry models” refer to the unit type "Infantry" in this context, or simply all models moving on the ground? If only models with the Infantry unit type may use the tunnel, this would, for example, exclude Raveners as they have the "Beasts" special rule and therefore count as "Beasts / Cavalry" units. Since Raveners were the most common companions for Trygons emerging from a tunnel, this seems to be a contradiction with previous publications, such as the Apocalypse Rulebook Furthermore, do Monstrous Creatures count as "Infantry" by means of using a Trygon tunnel?
Possible answer I: A Trygon tunnel may be used to enter the game by all models with one of the unit types "Infantry", "Beasts" or "Cavalry". No Models with wings may use the tunnel, as they are too fragile to move through an instable tunnel.
Possible answer II: A Trygon tunnel may be used to enter the game by all models with one of the unit types "Infantry", "Beasts", "Cavalry" or "Monstrous Creature". No Models with wings may use the tunnel, as they are too fragile to move through an instable tunnel.
Possible Answer III: Only models with the unit type "Infantry" may use a Trygon tunnel to enter the game board.
9) What happens if a Mycetic Spore becomes affected by a Tank Shock?
Possible arguments: When a unit is affected by a Tank Shock, it must take a morale check. If the test is passed, it may decide whether to simply step aside or to use the "Death or Honour" rule. If the test fails, the unit must fall back. However, Mycetic spores cannot move due to their special rules defined in the Codex: Tyranids (2010). Hence, they can neither fall back nor step aside when being tank-shocked.
Possible answer I: Since the Mycetic Spore simply does not have the choice to step aside, it *must* declare a "Death or Honour" attack against the tank that is shocking it after a successful morale check. Proceed as if you voluntarily decided to use "Death or Honour".
Furthermore, if the morale check failed, the Mycetic spore did not notice the tank approaching it and is torn apart. In that case, simply remove the Spore as a casualty.
Possible answer II: If the Mycetic Spore does not have to take the morale check because of being within synapse range or if it passes the morale check and wants to step aside, simply move the model away the minimum distance to let the tank pass. Imagine the tank not hitting the Spore hard enough to tear it apart, but just to push it aside its path.
Possible answer III: As Mycetic Spores are designed to act as living bombs and do not react as other creatures, they do not underlie the standard Tank shock rules defined in the rulebook. If a tank moves within 1 inch distance from a Mycetic Spore, the spore immediately explodes and is removes as a casualty. Treat the damage results as a direct hit to the side armour of the tank.
10) Can a Hive Tyrant that has joined a brood of Tyrant Guard be selected as a separate Target?
Possible arguments: The Tyrant Guard's "Shield Wall" special rule seems to intend that a Hive Tyrant that has joined the unit may not be directly chosen as a target. The rule says that a Hive Tyrant joins the unit exactly as if he would be an Independent Character Model. According to the rulebook, p. 49, Independent Characters that are Monstrous Creatures (such as the Tyrant) which join an infantry unit may be selected as a separate target unless the unit's special rules say something else. However, the "Shield Wall" rule does not clearly sate that the Tyrant can not be selected as separate target when joining the guard unit. Hence, the Tyrant Guard unit cannot protect its Tyrant by any means. Was this intended?
Possible answer I: Add the following sentence to the "Shield Wall" special rule: "A Tyrant that has joined a unit of Tyrant Guard can not be selected as a separate target." Tyrant Guards have only one purpose: to protect the Hive Tyrant at all costs.
Possible answer II: Erm, no, anything else would be completely ridicules... ^^
Possible answer III: Yes!
The following questions are for clarification purposes only as we think that “possible answer I” should be applicable. But as we came across these questions in several discussions in forums and during games, we still did not want to skip them.
11) Can we equip single (and not all) Raveners within a brood with Rending Claws, or is this option to be selected for every model within the unit?
Possible arguments: When offering options for certain units in the army list, the Codex: Tyranids (2010) applies the wording "the entire unit may..." in cases where all models in a unit must take the selected item. The wording "one model may..." is used in cases where only one model may select the option. The wording used for the Ravener's option "Rending Claws" is entirely different: "Every Ravener [...] may replace [...]". Hence, it is not clear what this formulation means.
Possible answer I: Replace the first option for the Ravener brood with the following:
"Any number of Raveners in the brood may replace one set of their Scything Talons with .... Rending claws: +5 points per model"
Possible answer II: Replace the first option for the Ravener brood with the following:
"The entire brood may replace one of their sets of Scything Talons with .... Rending claws: +5 points per model"
12) Can you please clarify in which situations a Hive Guard's target is granted a cover save?
Possible arguments: The rules for the Impaler Cannon in the Codex: Tyranids (2010) say that an enemy is only granted a cover save if he is directly within a piece of (area-)terrain or in direct contact with cover, such as standing directly behind a wall, which is located between the target and the Hive Guard unit. Are these two examples exhaustive? Are there any other types of cover which could grant the target a cover save against the Impaler Cannon? You could possibly think of, for example, Smoke Launchers, the Tau Disruption System or a previous Boost movement etc.
Possible answer I: Cover saves due to any special rule such as Smoke Launchers still can be taken against wounds inflicted by an Impaler Cannon, since there is a difference between "cover" and "cover save". "Cover" can grant a cover save under certain circumstances, but (as written in the Codex Tyranids 2010), against the Impaler Cannon some of those circumstances do not apply. However, a cover save granted by a special rule cannot be bypassed by the Impaler Cannon. Even the fancy targeting organisms of the Impaler Cannon can sometimes get confused by diffusive systems used by their victims.
Possible answer II: Cover saves due to any special rule such as Smoke Launchers cannot be taken against wounds inflicted by an Impaler Cannon. The fancy organisms that guide the projectile of the Impaler Cannon cannot be misguided by foolish technology such as smoke launchers etc. The Bio-magi of Holy Terra assume that the Hive Mind had detected this weakness centuries ago at the battle of Macragge and therefore was able to improve the targeting organisms of the Hive Guards accordingly.
13) Can a unit which the psychic power "Onslaught" was casted upon run twice in one single shooting phase?
Possible arguments: The text for the psychic power "Onslaught" states that the affected unit can both run and shoot in its own Shooting Phase. Does this mean that the unit can "run" exactly once and then "shoot" exactly one time, or may I replace the shooting with a second "run" movement? (The rulebook says that shooting can be replaced by running without restrictions.) Or does the rule text for "Onslaught" replaces the base rule and the unit can actually "Run" and "Shoot" only once?
Possible answer I: If onslaught is casted upon a unit, it may run and shoot only once. No additional replacements according to the rulebook are allowed.
Possible answer I: If onslaught is casted upon a unit, it may also run twice as it can replace its shooting with another “run”-movement.
